102 : Bucuresti Progresu - Giurgiu Nord - Giurgiu

Da, se va circula cu trenul local de marfa pana la Comana si atat. In rest... asteptam deblocarea fondurilor destinate reconstructiei podului cazut de la Gradistea. Sa speram ca il vedem activ inainte sa iesim la pensie...

Nu va fi niciun tren de călători pe Grădiștea-Giurgiu ? Mulțumesc !

liviulav33 a scris:

Nu va fi niciun tren de călători pe Grădiștea-Giurgiu ? Mulțumesc !

Nu , nici in livret nu exista .

I was shocked today when I saw in the timetable book there are no trains between Giurgiu and Gradistea    I'm not 100 % sure but I think there were no trains in 2013 timetable at first as well but they were running afterwards    I hope it happens this year as well. I saw some other lines are closed from 2014 where private operators were running.

CFR Călători owns a lot of money to CFR S.A. for the infrastructure fee. So it was forced to cnacel some trains and they preffered to cancel the trains on some routes with a very few number of tickets. The passengers did that to themselves when they were giving 1 or 2 RON to the conductor instead of buying a ticket.

Private operators not interested as well ?

I'm so laughing on hearing CFR has big debts thus operating with a smaller amount of personnel. For example in Bulgaria a train which travels between Sofia-Gorna oryahovitsa-Varna changes twice the drivers and the conductors personnel. Each brigade consists of TWO drivers + TWO conductors and ONE chef de train (hope it's clear) which means 10 people ! For the same distance in Romania you need ONE driver + ONE conductor.   Drivers here from certain train depots say they need to take a rest after 3 hours passing mountains that's why the only train connecting Northern and Southern Bulgaria Varna-Gorna oryahovitsa-Plovdiv will be shortened to Stara zagora so that train drivers can take a rest from the mountains run then continuing in 2 hours to Plovdiv as a different number and being a REGIO train.    (thos drivers who need to take a rest start from Gorna oryahovitsa, conductors change as well over there and in Stara zagora conductors change again)    So think again when you say Romanian railways are bad   

The problem Dr2005 discribes is very bad, I had it by myself when I was in Romania this year, a conductor wouldn't sell me a ticket when the ticket window in Avrig was closed... He said that a ticket would be 10 Lei between Avrig and Sibiu and he put the money in his own pocket.   I think a train can only run here when all passengers pay their tickets, and maybee hopefully in the futurure when the tracks are open between Giurgiu and Bucuresti, without travelling via Videle.

The thing vanchorusebulgaria discribed here is very common in Europe, a traindriver doesn't work for more than 3 or 4 hours, without a pause. In Olanda a traindriver works on an average working day between 7 and 9,5 hours, in Germany 7 and 11 hours. On such a shift, there is a pause from about 45 minutes halfway the day. It's very common that a traindriver get's of the train halfway the journey...

Below a shift for a traindriver in Groningen (Olanda):
Start:05:21 End:13:49 Total: 08:28hours
                                                 IRM IC 718   05:36 Groningen       08:26 Den Haag CS
                                                 IRM IC 2120  08:44 Den Haag CS  09:32 Amsterdam C
                                                 Pause       * 09:32 Asd     10:37 Asd  
                                                 IRM IC 837   10:37 Amsterdam C   11:06 Utrecht C  
                                                 ICM IC 539   11:50 Utrecht C       13:44 Groningen

The total distance is +-600 kilometers in this situation here.

Map of this shift:

IRM and ICM are the types of trains during the shift.
IRM

Caspar a scris:

The problem Dr2005 discribes is very bad, I had it by myself when I was in Romania this year, a conductor wouldn't sell me a ticket when the ticket window in Avrig was closed... He said that a ticket would be 10 Lei between Avrig and Sibiu and he put the money in his own pocket.   I think a train can only run here when all passengers pay their tickets, and maybee hopefully in the futurure when the tracks are open between Giurgiu and Bucuresti, without travelling via Videle.

The conductor saw that you are not from there and asked you for much money... a full-price ticket is 15,5 RON at IR (incl. compulsatory seat reservation) and 5,5 RON at R. A "regular" passenger would give 2 or 3 RON for the R and not more then 5 - 6 RON at R.
The only way to force the conductor to work properly is to pay them according the number of ticket they sell and cancel the train if the number of tickets is low (wich can mean that the conductor will have to find a new job).

A Romanian train driver drives 7 - 8 hours, but the total work time (including papework between departure and moving the locomotive from the yard to the station) must not exceed 9 or 10 hours.
The chef of the train and the conductor(s) ussually work on the whole route of the train, that can even mean 12 hours or more.

Dr2055, your ideea would mean that a lot of trains in Romania would be canceled or that they would have Malaxa instead of Desiro, ADH or coaches. Simply because even if the conductors would be honest they aren't enough passengers. Still, a lot of conductors should be left jobless because they're just incapable of giving a ticket.  :roll:

Vancho, if the bulgarian drivers are cmplaining, I can tell you that I've heard a discussion between drivers from Regio Trans. Comparing to what they were saying in Bulgaria driving a train seems more like a hobby.  

adirmvl a scris:

Dr2055, your ideea would mean that a lot of trains in Romania would be canceled or that they would have Malaxa instead of Desiro, ADH or coaches. Simply because even if the conductors would be honest they aren't enough passengers. Still, a lot of conductors should be left jobless because they're just incapable of giving a ticket.  :roll:

Well... many of them deserves to be left unemployed. I've been to Târgovişte a few day ago... we were 20 bikers + our bikes and about 70 - 80 other people in that 72-seats Desiro. There were exactly 20 tickets saold at that trains (guess for wich passengers). The rest payed 3 RON for Bucureşti - Titu, 2 RON for Chitila/Săbăreni - Titu, 2 RON for Titu - Târgovişte and 1 RON for any other smaller distance. The trip took about 1h50min for 80 km and the regular price is 11 RON. A bus/minibus trip takes about 1h15 - 1h30min and costs about 18 RON. A trip with an IR train takes about 1h40min and costs 25 RON. The 72-seats Desiro used on Regio trains is more comfortable than the 120-seats Desiro used on IR  :shock:
Our group had 3 group tickets (for 5 persons each, that means a 25% discount for each group member) and 5 50% discount tickets (student). The group tickets were bought by a member of the group... so we had to give him the money. The conductor was very happy seeing 15 people with 15 RON in their hands... he came near us and made a ,,give me" sign with his hand   You should've seen his face when we told him that we have group tickets and we were just paying our friend who bought them   Of course, he then counted all our bikes and people 3 times to make shure that we all had a valid ticket for us and for our bikes.

Maybee CFR must introduce "mystery guests'' some kind of managers who sit in the train and see if a conductor works properly with ticket controlling and selling. If a conductur fails, and accept money without selling an official ticket, give him first a warning, and in a second time the message that he must find a new job?

We have "supracontrol". Hope it's clear what it means. And the conductors split the money they get from passengers with them. That money goes very up. So: not the full 10 lei the conductor took from you were for him and also (some of) the jobs are conditioned by this thing.

Now, the union blames CFR only when it's members are left without jobs, but never says a thing about this thing that makes CFR Calatori rot from the inside.

Dr2005 a scris:

The only way to force the conductor to work properly is to pay them according the number of ticket they sell and cancel the train if the number of tickets is low (wich can mean that the conductor will have to find a new job).

Well you can't do that, on Timisoara - Arad the trains are full, there are  passengers with subscriptions and passengers with a ticket  and in most of the stops there is a ticket office. The only passengers that don't have a ticket are the ones that arrived too late to buy one, or the ticket office was crowded. So they buy one in the train at a high price.
There are days when the conductor dosen't sell a single ticket...

In Iulie 2014 incep lucrarile la pod.

http://www.primariagiurgiu.ro/portal/giurgiu/primarie/stiri.nsf/0/B61BAAC63114597AC2257C2E003CDFDC/$FILE/Adrese_obiectiv_investitie_Redeschidere_circulatie_feroviara_CF_Bucuresti-_Giurgiu_%281%29.pdf

Studiul de fezabilitate este valabil 2 ani. Cel din 2008 deja e expirat.
La momentul emiterii adresei, bugetul pe anul 2014 era doar la nivel de propunere. Nu ştiu dacă în bugetul pe 2014 sunt prinse asemenea lucrări. Până acum, pe toate listele de proiecte primite de la CFR S.A. apare acest proiect cu finanţare zero.