Trenuri internaţionale

OK, thanks. Don't you think this is a kind of a Balkan idioticism :shock: A train crosses the country, travelling an hour less than the regular trains, stopping in a few places on route, but you cannot use it. From Russe for example those trains arrive and departure at stupid times at night but there are some which can be prettu useful. But there's no initiativeness ...

ieri la ora 08:10 la statia PL.Sud R 1384 Sofia-Russe-Giurgiu.Nord-Buc.Nord-Suceava-Moscova avea intarziere 150 min , azi la aceasi ora 08:10 avea 100 min intarziere. Stie cineva ce factor sau factori duce la aceasta intarziere zilnica ?? Grupa de Suceava mai circula si daca da mai sunt calatori care sa mearga de la Bucuresti pana dincolo de Bacau aproape de Suceava, ca banuiesc ca cei care merg pana la Bacau aleg A 1655 ??

lucrarii , control vamal, restrcitii de vreme ???

la 11:05 a ajuns R 1384 azi cu 200 min intarziere 41-0255 + Grupa de Suceava + 9 vag de dormit.

The winter version ot this tran 382/383 was also late with times like that in the start of the current timetable December 2010 - February 2011. Afterwards it was better and the delays were not that embarassing and frequent. I hope with this train is going to happen the same. We shall see. In Bulgaria it's really stupid that this train departures at 2.55 to Sofia but it's always late and in that case just a one heavy wagon from the train Saratov-Sofia should go with the normal Rapid 4611 Ruse-Sofia just in one day - Tuesday... But in the whole year because of this coach the train is slowed down to 100 km/h, no matter that the track allows speed over 100 km/h. But because of the heavier Russian sleeping cars the train cannot go over 100 km/h ... IT'S stupid with this big delays

Deoarece la granitele Romaniei majoritatea trenurilor prind intarziere (vamesii si lucratorii vamali se misca incet) si mai ales ca acest tren vata este foarte plin de rusii care sunt cetatenii din afara UE.

vanchorusebulgaria a scris:

The winter version ot this tran 382/383 was also late with times like that in the start of the current timetable December 2010 - February 2011. Afterwards it was better and the delays were not that embarassing and frequent. I hope with this train is going to happen the same. We shall see. In Bulgaria it's really stupid that this train departures at 2.55 to Sofia but it's always late and in that case just a one heavy wagon from the train Saratov-Sofia should go with the normal Rapid 4611 Ruse-Sofia just in one day - Tuesday... But in the whole year because of this coach the train is slowed down to 100 km/h, no matter that the track allows speed over 100 km/h. But because of the heavier Russian sleeping cars the train cannot go over 100 km/h ... IT'S stupid with this big delays

You cannot use Russian trains domestically (in either Bulgaria or Romania) as there is no cabotage rights agreement between Romania or Bulgaria and Russia. As in freedoms of the sky, railway cabotage rights (i.e. the right to use an international train for domestic passengers in a third country, ex. using a Russian train to carry passengers from Russe to Varna) are governed by various international treaties and laws. Further, each of these international trains (RZD, BC, UZ) are governed by bilateral agreements signed either directly by governments or under the aegis of OSZhD.

All this paperwork makes it very hard to allow cabotage rights to a single train. It's not a Balkan thing, this happens throughout the world - even in the EU, this happened as recently as the 1980s!

Further, there's some practicalities involved here. Neither Bulgaria nor Romania are part of RZD's reservation network (they use a highly simplified access gateway, through a mainly phone-based system). Selling a ticket Ruse to Varna would thus be possible within Russia (or through a Russian travel agency), but nearly impossible from within Bulgaria (as the Bulgarians would simply not know in advance which seats are or aren't available). Installing RZD's system (which, imho, is absolutely fantastic, I would say the absolute best in the world for railways), is unfortunately expensive. Really, really, really expensive.

Further, from what I know, these trains are mainly of Kupë type (I doubt they have any platskartnyy cars attached), making a 5 hours ticket within Bulgaria quite expensive even if it would be permitted. Further, who would get payment? RZD, since it operated the train? BDZ, since it's Bulgaria? This has to be negotiated, either for the whole country (giving a 'freedom of the rail') or for each individual train.

Most Russian cars (there are exceptions) are limited to 100 km/h when regauged to standard-gauge. It's not because of weight, but rather because of the incompatible breaking systems and because of the trucks (bogies). On 1520/1524 most types of Russian cars can comfortably travel between 120 and 140, even when pulled by a relatively low-power Finnish locomotive.

I'm surely talking about a Bulgarian car. Just one from Russe to Varna. It won't have nothing to deal with the Russian sleeping cars.. Either it won't be that hard for the wieght of the train as BDZ tried to explain that to me ... The loco is Bulgarian, the infrastructure is Bulgarian, so what's the problem of attaching just one carriage :shock: I don't think it should be so compicated or out of law... I don't mean to have nothing to embarrass foreign visitors. God damn, it cannot be so hard to travel comfortably and fast without stops... If some rights like that are authorized by World Rail Organisations what we are talking about ... To travel from the other part of Europe to Varna, but not to can do this from a City which is 200 km away. I can't understand that

p.s. Lead of this : why Romanian and Bulgarian cars are attached to the regular trains 382/383 and 1384/1385 ? Because they run all the time, at the whole timetable and they are not seasonal ? What's the problem the same to be practised with the seasonal trains. Moreover Varna is on the Black Sea and crouds of people go in the summer ... But not by a train because it's slow and stops at too many stations. We have a great train in some days of the summer which travels much faster and doesn't run at the hot part of the day. No we cannot use it ! It's ridiculous !

Well, you can travel from Iași to Varna or Sofia, for example in such a train. At kupe.

6822 Debrecen-Satu Mare 24.06.2011

Stie cineva, mai exista trenuri internationale cu circulatie sezoniera ce fac legatura intre Cehia, Germania, Slovacia, Polonia, Ungaria si litoralul bugaresc sau, de ce nu, cel romanesc ? Daca da, puteti da exemple si cand circula si pe ce ruta ?!

iDorin a scris:

Stie cineva, mai exista trenuri internationale cu circulatie sezoniera ce fac legatura intre Cehia, Germania, Slovacia, Polonia, Ungaria si litoralul bugaresc sau, de ce nu, cel romanesc ? Daca da, puteti da exemple si cand circula si pe ce ruta ?!

Tren internaţional "NESSEBAR" Budapesta Keleti - Varna/Burgas
Nr. 1471-2 LOKOSHAZA - CURTICI - DEVA - CRAIOVA - VIDELE
Nr. 1471 VIDELE - GIURGIU NORD - RUSE
Circulă în zilele de 5/6 în perioada 24/25.06 - 9/10.09.2011
0 Curtici 15:08 0:01 15:08
17 Arad 15:37 0:02 15:39
166 Deva 17:55 0:02 17:57
175 Simeria 18:07 0:02 18:09
255 Petrosani 19:52 0:03 19:55
305 Tirgu Jiu 21:04 0:04 21:08
412 Craiova 22:38 0:12 22:50
570 Videle 1:07 0:20 1:27
634 Giurgiu Nord 2:44 0:01 2:44

Tren internaţional "NESSEBAR" Varna/Burgas - Budapesta Keleti
Nr. 1470 RUSE - GIURGIU NORD - VIDELE
Nr. 1470-1 VIDELE - CRAIOVA - DEVA - CURTICI - LOKOSHAZA
Circulă în zilele de 7 în perioada 26.06 - 11.09.2011.
0 Giurgiu Nord 2:55 0:01 2:55
64 Videle 4:05 0:15 4:20
222 Craiova 6:36 0:19 6:55
329 Tirgu Jiu 8:23 0:15 8:38
379 Petrosani 9:46 0:02 9:48
459 Simeria 11:28 0:12 11:40
468 Deva 11:51 0:02 11:53
617 Arad 14:01 0:03 14:04
634 Curtici 14:31 0:01 14:31

Are vagoane slovace poloneze si din Cehia

adrian78hd a scris:

Tren internaţional "NESSEBAR" Budapesta Keleti - Varna/Burgas
Nr. 1471-2 LOKOSHAZA - CURTICI - DEVA - CRAIOVA - VIDELE
Nr. 1471 VIDELE - GIURGIU NORD - RUSE
Circulă în zilele de 5/6 în perioada 24/25.06 - 9/10.09.2011[/b]

Tren internaţional "NESSEBAR" Varna/Burgas - Budapesta Keleti
Nr. 1470 RUSE - GIURGIU NORD - VIDELE
Nr. 1470-1 VIDELE - CRAIOVA - DEVA - CURTICI - LOKOSHAZA

Are vagoane slovace poloneze si din Cehia

Din cate au fost doar atat a mai ramas ? Si doar o singura zi pe saptamana ? Daca vagoanele vin si din Cehia, Slovacia si Polonia, ai idee daca sosesc in Budapest Keleti cu trenuri regulate ?
Stiam ceva de acest tren, cu ceva ani in urma, doar ca avea cate o zi de circulatie pt Cehia, Slovacia si Ungaria, si doua zile pt Polonia. Deci, avea o circulatie de 5 ori pe saptamana.
Mai sunt si alte trenuri care tranziteaza teritoriul Romaniei si nu sunt prevazute in MT ? Nu trebuie sa fie neapart sezoniere sau pt litoralul bulgaresc sau cel romanesc.

De fapt trenul Nesebar porneste din Praga (deci un tren aparte, nu doar vagoane atasate altor trenuri): are 1 vagon cl. a 2-a, 4 cusete si 2 vagoane de dormit (toate CD). In Breclav primeste un vagon cuseta PKP care vine de la Varsovia cu trenul 407 "Chopin" (Varsovia - Viena), iar la Bratislava i se mai ataseaza 4 vagoane cuseta ZSSK. In fine, la Budapesta mai primeste un vagon de dormit MAV. Tot la Budapesta detaseaza un vagon cuseta care circula pe ruta Bratislava - Budapesta - Bar.

Informatii despre compunerile trenurilor din Europa (mai ales cele internationale) gasiti pe pagina http://www.vagonweb.cz/

Multumesc mitza pentru completare eu am avut impresia gresita ca s-a inteles ca pleaca din Praga..
Eu am cautat ceva trenul ala pe wagonweb la R dar nu credeam ca au asa multe Rapide plus ca am ramas surpins cate trenuri internationale au cehii si noi ne plangem in tara ca nu avem destule vagoane pentru sezoniere!!
Sper sa se schimbe strategia celor de la CFR si sa revine vechile trenuri internationale cu legaturi spre Munchen Praga Varsovia Venetia cu tarife decente

Nu cred ca vom mai vedea legatura spre Praga , Munchen , Berlin , Warszawa , Venezia deja am renuntat la visul asta ar fi ceva frumos sa mai existe legaturi cu aceste capitale dar slabe sanse la cat de bine se misca CFR .

Un exemplu ar fi ca ar putea baga un tren EC pe ruta Timisoara-Kosice-Krakow-Warszawa care sa plece la 6 sau 7 din Timisoara pana seara ajunge in Warszawa dar cine sa gandeasca legaturi cat mai convenabile , lasa ca fac autocarele bani ca de aia stiu cum sa atraga clientii . Exemplele la legaturi cat mai favorabile pot contina dar vorbim degeaba .